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Mammonther
Junior Boarder
Posts: 26
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The bow seat is closer to centre. If the canoe is turned around and paddled from here it distributes the paddler's weight closer to centre. I guess it still depends upon cargo distribution. Some seats do not accomodate reverse seating. (i.e. the Kipawa).
****************************************************** Paddle Slowly : the ride is over soon enough.
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Baranello
Junior Boarder
Posts: 25
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You won't have as much flexibility as you might initially think. You are relatively compact and your gear isn't. This is a 'been there, done that' observation.
I've found that for most paddling, reversing the canoe and paddling from the forward seat facing backwards and the gear ahead of me suits conditions just fine. I guess you'd call this 1/3 from the stern.
However, in extreme headwinds, I found that kneeling as close to the center thwart was mandatory and it was difficult to get enough gear forward to control easily.
I think the best answer to you question is - that depends. Realistically, you'll be moving yourself and your gear around according to conditions.
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gluxarewers
Senior Boarder
Posts: 40
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I'm intending to install only a single seat. I'm thinking about putting it at roughly one-third from the stern. I'll also put kneeling pads in front of that seat and I'll make them long enough to give the choice of leaning against the seat or of moving up to the carrying yoke. With no seat in the bow, I'll don't believe that I will have any trouble getting enough gear forward to make the boat bow down for headwinds. You all know how hard it is to hold a straight line into a headwind. If I can be any toward the stern at all, the effectiveness of correction strokes will be increased.
Everyone: this discussion is focusing my thoughts very quickly. Please continue with your advice and observations.
Thanks.
Tommy T.
Quick turning to catch eddies, etc. is not going to be an issue, but handling sizeable waves might be. Letting the bow go high with gear amidships and me at the 1/3 point should help with that.
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Arkhew
Junior Boarder
Posts: 28
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Ideally what you want (if you only have one seat) is a neautral position with you in the boat. By that I mean the boat should lie flat in the water with you in the proposed position. You can then alter trim with your gear as required.
A good starting point is with the seat edge about 18 inches behind the carrying thwart.
Don't forget to replace the seats you remove with thwarts ot help maintin hull rigidity.
FWIW you could do a lot worse than a kevlar Langford Prospector for the sort of trip you are doing. Light and beautifully manouverable.
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bluntedboy
Junior Boarder
Posts: 39
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Folks, thanks a lot. This discussion is proving to be very helpful. My compliments on an excellent news group. The following information is to try to bring into a little sharper focus my specific interests for information.
I own six canoes and kayaks. I have been paddling for over 50 years and have received quality instruction from a variety of paddling schools and from private sessions with ACA certified instructors. I have won the New England Canoe Orienteering Championships twice in tandem and once in singles. I have made a two-week trip in the upper U.S. Midwest, a ten-day trip in northern Maine and a ten day trip in the Everglades Swamp, all in tandem boats. I have served as an assistant guide for a commercial sea kayak outfitter. I paddle Class IV white water and have a hand roll. (I also am a backpacker and climber. I have been out for as long as 5 weeks on a traverse of Mt. McKinley.)
I am planning a trip down the Yukon River from Whitehorse about 2000 miles to Norton Sound. The water flow will range from 6 knot quick water in the first 500 miles, to 2 knots for most of the last 500 miles, to tidal at end. At most, one short Class I+ rapid may be encountered. I expect the overall time on the river to be between 60 and 80 days.
Surprisingly, none of my boats are really suitable for a long, solo quick and flat water trip. They include an 18 foot kevlar asymmeteric Jonathan Winter design based on a marathon boat waterline with flared sides above to increase secondary stability and load carrying capacity. It is a fantastic long distance boat but cannot be soloed. I have a flat bottom, 36' beam Royalex 16 footer that I can stand up in to fly fish
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Mirakopl
Junior Boarder
Posts: 25
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In the summer of 2000, my girlfriend and I paddled from Lake Bennet to Emmonak, eight miles before the Berring Sea. We used a FeatherCraft K2 Expedition double and it performed very nicely. It took us 10 weeks on the water. In the upper river we saw people paddling everything from aluminum rental canoes to rudderless Old Town Loons (Kayaks) to some very sleek plastic Kayaks. Most anything will float down the river. Witness the huge driftoow trees in the delta that floated hundreds of miles.
There are some factors and considerations in selecting a boat that you may not be considering:
Shipping at the end: getting a boat out of the delta back to whereever you live can be difficult and/or expensive. A folding boat simplifies this to some degree. Our boats went on as extra baggage for a small fee.
Airfreight from Emmonak to Anchorage was about 35 to 50 cents a pound in 2000, with some weight and length restricitions. We met two people who sent their hardshell kayaks that way to Anchorage. They sold them in Anchorage because it was prohibitvely expensive to ship them from there back to Vancouver or Seattle. It would have cost more than they paid for the boat. But, in Anchorage, the same shipping costs of bringing boats TO a retail market there, meant they could sell their used kayaks for more than they paid to buy them new. We have met others who resolved this dilemna by buying cheap canoes and just leaving their boats in Emmonak or selling them for a few dollars.
Cost aside - other considerations: Waves, channels, current, and river's width. The flow of the river, as you noted, slows down towards the end. But several features of the river may factor into your equipment decisions.
The river's current is strong in the upper river. We encountered flows approx 6 to 8 mph bewtween Whitehorse and Dawson. In the lower river, from Galena to the end it was much slower, generaly around 2 mph. Paddling is necessary on the lower river. But another big difference is that in the upper river the current is generally strong both inside of wide channels as well as outside of those channels. In the lower river, if you are not in the channel, the current may be so slow that the wind pushes you back upstream.
The winds were generally strong and generally blowing upriver during the last 5 weeks. Wind generated waves were frequently 1 to 2 feet and on occasions reached 3 to 4 feet. These factors would mean that river crossings were inevitable, to keep in the current or out of the worst of the wind waves. The river was generally over a mile wide and frequently 2+ miles wide. With water temps in the low 50's and air temps (in August) ranging from the low 30's to the low 50s, keeping water out of the boat and keeping us out of the water were very important.
So, your considerations should include how well the boat performs in such conditions. We found that the spray skirt with the K2 kept us very warm and dry. I would not have personally wanted to be in an open canoe in such conditions. Another feature we enjoyed was the 'sling' system that Feathercraft uses on this as well as several other of their models. The seat can be adjusted to a variety of positions, including adjustment up or down. It also provided flexibility with motion.
Other factors in boat and gear considerations:
There are some campsites that will require you to unload in mud and carry gear as well as the boat over fairly long stretches of mud and/or sand to suitible campsites.
You will want to stop in villages for supplies etc - if you are single you will need to leave your boat and gear unattended. We had no problems and were generally treated well by villagers. They were friendly to us but did definitly see us as outsiders. Our gear was never touched when we left it unnatended, but we tried to do that as little as possible for as short a time period as possible.
During the last 1,000 miles bear tracks were present on every of ground we saw except the most remote sandbars. Again, we had no specific problems or conflicting encounters, but keep in mind that the boat may attract bears if there are food scents present on it and be prepared as much as possible to deal with any bear inflicted damage to your vessel.
If there are other aspects of your trip that I can lend any insight you can let me know directly if you prefer.
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ScottPithan
Junior Boarder
Posts: 23
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Phil,
Thanks so much for this response and the invitation to contact you directly, you have the most recent experience of the full river of anyone that I have found.
For the benefit of the those who have been following this thread in the news group, I will respond to some of your specific points.
My intention is to airfreight back from Emmonak. The rate is even less if the canoe is sent on a kind of baggage stand-by basis. Air cargo flights from Emmonak are at least 5 days a week.
I have a wife who will drive me to Whitehorse, store the car, fly home and then fly back and pick me up in Anchorage. This was a huge factor in deciding that the trip was doable.
The canoe I will be using has a low profile, a reputation for running dry in waves, good tracking, an efficient hull design, large load carrying capaciy and a seat that adjusts back and forth as well as up and down. An adjustable foot rest matches seat movement. I will be using a full, fitted fabric spray deck
An advantage of the canoe is that most of my gear will be carried in two large dry bag/back packs. I'll discuss footwear with you in private.
I'm hoping that a lashed down spray skirt will discourage casual investigation of my supplies. I'll discuss your experiences in reprovisioning in private. I am most interested in what you found in the village stores and how prices were.
On a three week backpack in the Canadian Rockies, we had black bear in our camp every day, both in the afternoon and at night, every single day. Bear-bagging and cooking way away from the tent was sufficient care. I am concerned about grizzlies and about the lack of bear-bagging opportunities and the impracticality of cooking at a remote spot. A number of Alaska outdoorsmen have insisted that a shotgun be considered mandatory. Years ago I hunted with shotgun and with bow and arrow, but I have never carried a gun with the thought that it was needed for protection. This is proving to be a difficult decision for me and one about which I have considerable conflict in my own thinking.
Thank you very much. I will contact you.
Tommy T.
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